America's Cup 2017

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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Careless Whisperer @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:32 am

My brain just keeps screaming to move the front foils further forward. It just looks so unstable as it is and no wonder the front keeps diving.

But yes, I know that they're all like this so there is obviously a good reason.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Dirk @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:26 am

One reason is maneuverability. With the foils at the bow turning would be very difficult.

But I think it is less efficient too, I'm not sure of all the reasons but one is that the rudders would now have to perform half the lift. Its more efficient to have one main set of lifting wing surfaces, plus because the rudders rotate its harder to control the lift from them

Compare with an aircraft with main wings in the middle(ish) and the rudder at the back.

But yes, it can get a bit unstable:

Ben getting it right (ish)

Original video page: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYGgOhEXQ50&feature=youtu.be


USA getting it wrong

Original video page: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cKS2-WsN3Y&feature=youtu.be


USA getting it very wrong

Original video page: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DFVs25F4dQ
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Hooli @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:27 pm

Amazingly good to watch considering no engines are involved.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by ttwiggy @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:05 pm

Hooli wrote:Amazingly good to watch considering no engines are involved.


I'm as much a fan of internal combustion engine as anyone, and I've been on boats with plenty of horsepower, but if you get the opportunity to experience a sailing boat I really could not recommend it enough.

Nothing, for me, beats the feeling of wind power over water. It doesn't matter what sort of speed you're making, it's just such a visceral experience - on one hand almost silent and entirely 'natural' while on the other you feel completely connected to the power of nature and the physics of the process in a way that a purely mechanical device could never deliver.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Tokyo Sexwale @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:26 pm

Well put ttwiggy, my experiences of 'pushing on' in a sail boat left me completely blown away (yes) with the sheer power of nature. You can hear and feel the forces at work in away you can't with engine power.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by ttwiggy @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:34 pm

Tokyo Sexwale wrote:Well put ttwiggy, my experiences of 'pushing on' in a sail boat left me completely blown away (yes) with the sheer power of nature. You can hear and feel the forces at work in away you can't with engine power.


It's incredible isn't it? Feeling the force of the wind through the sheets and the way the whole boat almost 'tenses' under the strain. If you get the chance then it's well worth having a 'go' on a wooden ship - particularly something approaching full-rigged - as you can feel the whole thing come alive.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Tokyo Sexwale @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:41 pm

ttwiggy wrote:
Tokyo Sexwale wrote:Well put ttwiggy, my experiences of 'pushing on' in a sail boat left me completely blown away (yes) with the sheer power of nature. You can hear and feel the forces at work in away you can't with engine power.


It's incredible isn't it? Feeling the force of the wind through the sheets and the way the whole boat almost 'tenses' under the strain. If you get the chance then it's well worth having a 'go' on a wooden ship - particularly something approaching full-rigged - as you can feel the whole thing come alive.

I'd love to. I can't imagine how these massive racing rigs must feel onboard either, there must be some enormous forces at work.

Semi-related, a mate of mine used to sail for a living and worked in the superyacht arena where the boats had everything on the options list ticked. He said he'd be on these huge, multi-million pound boats single handedly sailing them as you could do everything electronically - change tack, sails etc. Sounded brilliant.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by ttwiggy @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:50 pm

Tokyo Sexwale wrote:
ttwiggy wrote:
Tokyo Sexwale wrote:Well put ttwiggy, my experiences of 'pushing on' in a sail boat left me completely blown away (yes) with the sheer power of nature. You can hear and feel the forces at work in away you can't with engine power.


It's incredible isn't it? Feeling the force of the wind through the sheets and the way the whole boat almost 'tenses' under the strain. If you get the chance then it's well worth having a 'go' on a wooden ship - particularly something approaching full-rigged - as you can feel the whole thing come alive.

I'd love to. I can't imagine how these massive racing rigs must feel onboard either, there must be some enormous forces at work.

Semi-related, a mate of mine used to sail for a living and worked in the superyacht arena where the boats had everything on the options list ticked. He said he'd be on these huge, multi-million pound boats single handedly sailing them as you could do everything electronically - change tack, sails etc. Sounded brilliant.


I've been on a couple of sail boats with electric winches for the hawsers, which is a nice comfort option especially with a big sail to raise, but I couldn't imagine using auto-taking etc as that's part of the fun!

When I was in the RN I got the chance to crew a Victorian schooner off Bermuda that was semi ship-rigged (the main mast was square-rigged with stay sails everywhere else). I didn't get to go aloft as they didn't want any of us getting killed to death, but I remember how you could feel the forces through the decking when we were under full sail and the stays and shrouds were almost singing with tension. Sailing boats are magical things.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Hooli @ Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:51 pm

Totally agree real sailing ships are magical things.

Those America cup boats seem more like engine less powerboats to my mind, hence my comment.
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Re: America's Cup 2017

Post by Dirk @ Sat Apr 22, 2017 9:55 am

One of the best things about sailing is the sheer range of choices. All give that primaeval joy from being on the water and using the elements to propel you. But you can get anything from a kid in an optimist on their own, or a couple pottering round the coast, or a supercharged offshore team or an AC50 like those up there- and many other options. Some are peaceful, some noisy and dangerous.

I dont think any other sport gives that variety
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