Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

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Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 7:55 pm

My heating is doing a weird thing.

After half an hour or so of it coming on, the radiators start making an absolutely awful hammering noise. It's really loud and shits up the dog and it's pissing me off.

Things I've tried:

'Bleeding' the radiators (all fine it seems and no cold spots either)

That's it.

The one in the lounge has a broken turny thing at the bottom that makes it hotter or colder (it's a white plastic knob with numbers on it). My investigations suggest that what actually happens when you turn it is that it pushes down or releases a pin that presumably lets more or less water into the radiator?

Anyway, fcuking about with the pin can sometimes make that particular one shut up but not really and it's been broken forever and has never been a problem so I've sort of ignored that by duct taping a 2p coin over it to push the pin in and am ignoring it.

Any ideas?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Freddie @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:06 pm

Earthquake?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by foo @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:08 pm

Isn't it just air trapped in the system? I am of course not a heating engineer.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:14 pm

foo wrote:Isn't it just air trapped in the system? I am of course not a heating engineer.



I think bleeding ought to fcuk any air right off...shouldn't it?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by moleamol @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:26 pm

Disastrous wrote:
foo wrote:Isn't it just air trapped in the system? I am of course not a heating engineer.



I think bleeding ought to fcuk any air right off...shouldn't it?

Only if you do it properly you half arsed lesbian!
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Käsemeister @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:27 pm

You need to bleed the air at the highest point.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:31 pm

Käsemeister wrote:You need to bleed the air at the highest point.



You can only bleed them at the bleed valve, surely? Which is at the top.

I've bled, re-heated, cooled and bled some more so pretty confident there isn't any air left.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Strawman @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:37 pm

Poltergeists
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Käsemeister @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:42 pm

Highest point of the system you berk.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Fred Flange @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:47 pm

its called water hammer (strangely)

You need a high point vent, not necessarily open dependent on your system, I installed a straight run blanked off 18mm x 1 metre vertical line from my CW tank and this cured it.

BTW, mine sounded like the end of the world was coming.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:48 pm

Käsemeister wrote:Highest point of the system you berk.



Is this a different thing to bleeding radiators??

Are you talking about bleeding the boiler?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Fred Flange @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:52 pm

nowt to do with bleeding owt.

Its in the cw inlet system, pressure can't go anywhere so a vent is the answer. I'm not a plumber, merely a chartered mech engineer but a bit of savvy goes far.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 8:54 pm

Fred Flange wrote:nowt to do with bleeding owt.

Its in the cw inlet system, pressure can't go anywhere so a vent is the answer. I'm not a plumber, merely a chartered mech engineer but a bit of savvy goes far.



Soz, I meant to KM - I don't like the sound of this water hammer thing.

Presumably, this means getting someone in to do something?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Tokyo Sexwale @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:03 pm

Bleed the highest rad in your place. Or towel rail or wev.

Eta. With the heating off.
Last edited by Tokyo Sexwale on Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:04 pm

Tokyo Sexwale wrote:Bleed the highest rad in your place. Or towel rail or wev.

Eta. With the heating off.



They're all the same height - only thing higher is the boiler...
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by thekungfury @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:04 pm

I had a water hammer and had to get a man in. It got exponentially worse in the days before he came and it ended up sounding like actual hell.

He was able to just get rid of the air but he did mention a thing you can attach to the pipes like an anti-hammer device.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Monty @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:31 pm

I had water hammer that was caused by the water pressure into the cold water tank being too high. The plumber had been doing some work to my boiler which involved turning the stop cock off in the road (rather than pissing about under the sink to isolate the water), when he turned to valve back on he must've opened the tap further than before.
After much fvcking about by me, he eventually came back & solved it by turning the tap outside, down a bit. It was trial & error to get to this point which just reinforced my view that he was useless!
The water hammer 'trick' is to attach something like a CD to the ball cock arm to prevent it from oscillating (in the CW tank)...the CD acts as a kind of sea anchor for want of a better description. I tried this and it didn't work as I couldn't attach the CD securely enough!

I'm not convinced that you're actually getting water hammer through radiators...it's more than likely air that needs bleeding from them...as has been said already.

<not a plumber>
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Strawman @ Tue Apr 05, 2016 9:47 pm

I think we need this documenting on youtube or soundcloud or some other part of the internet so we can all listen to this noise, it will help with our advices.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:29 am

Here you go:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5iaj4ufu98x4fmk/Radiator.m4a?dl=0

This is just after it came on this morning...
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Strawman @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:32 am

That's quite funky, couldn't you build a floor filling techno anthem around that?
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Deuteronomy @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:41 am

I've not listened to it as I'm fcuking tres busy this morning, but if there's definitely no air in the system try adjusting the TRVs - (thermostatic radiator valves)

With most systems you always should have one radiator that it always fully open otherwise the pump is trying to run against a closed system.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by stuart @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:44 am

Disastrous wrote:Here you go:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5iaj4ufu98x4fmk/Radiator.m4a?dl=0

This is just after it came on this morning...


biglaugh
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by stuart @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:45 am

Heating engineering was at my new place and recommends some magnetic flushing thing gets done. Wants £1000 for it!
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:03 am

Strawms - yes I could, but I'm starting to feel like that man from Spaced who was so off his tits he was hearing techno out the toaster.

Deuts - Interesting you say that. Pissing about with the valves can sort of balance it and make it stop *sometimes* but not always. Didn't know that about always being slightly open though so will start again with that in mind tonight.

Stuart - That's ridiculous! I'm not paying anything at all for some magnet-based cleaning system. Might as well use Voodoo.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Deuteronomy @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:21 am

Disastrous wrote:Strawms - yes I could, but I'm starting to feel like that man from Spaced who was so off his tits he was hearing techno out the toaster.

Deuts - Interesting you say that. Pissing about with the valves can sort of balance it and make it stop *sometimes* but not always. Didn't know that about always being slightly open though so will start again with that in mind tonight.

Stuart - That's ridiculous! I'm not paying anything at all for some magnet-based cleaning system. Might as well use Voodoo.


No, you need one fully open, usually the bathroom towel radiator as they're pretty shit for heating the room.

Essentially the hammering can be caused by the TRVs being forced open then snapping shut as the pressure drops as the flow rate increases.

I
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:23 am

Deuteronomy wrote:
Disastrous wrote:Strawms - yes I could, but I'm starting to feel like that man from Spaced who was so off his tits he was hearing techno out the toaster.

Deuts - Interesting you say that. Pissing about with the valves can sort of balance it and make it stop *sometimes* but not always. Didn't know that about always being slightly open though so will start again with that in mind tonight.

Stuart - That's ridiculous! I'm not paying anything at all for some magnet-based cleaning system. Might as well use Voodoo.


No, you need one fully open, usually the bathroom towel radiator as they're pretty shit for heating the room.

Essentially the hammering can be caused by the TRVs being forced open then snapping shut as the pressure drops as the flow rate increases.

I



Noted. Now you mention the bathroom towel radiator, I suspect it is always fully open but will double check.
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Käsemeister @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:41 am

FFS sample it!
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:48 am

Käsemeister wrote:FFS sample it!



Original video page: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfSndZPynQk
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Il Duce @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 11:22 am

Disastrous wrote:
Deuteronomy wrote:
Disastrous wrote:Strawms - yes I could, but I'm starting to feel like that man from Spaced who was so off his tits he was hearing techno out the toaster.

Deuts - Interesting you say that. Pissing about with the valves can sort of balance it and make it stop *sometimes* but not always. Didn't know that about always being slightly open though so will start again with that in mind tonight.

Stuart - That's ridiculous! I'm not paying anything at all for some magnet-based cleaning system. Might as well use Voodoo.


No, you need one fully open, usually the bathroom towel radiator as they're pretty shit for heating the room.

Essentially the hammering can be caused by the TRVs being forced open then snapping shut as the pressure drops as the flow rate increases.

I



Noted. Now you mention the bathroom towel radiator, I suspect it is always fully open but will double check.


Remove that broken TRV on the one radiator. See if that stops it.
You should be able to just unscrew the furled bit, below the white plastic bit, by hand and it and take it off.
Don't worry, no water will come out.

Image
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Re: Why are my radiators 'hammering'?

Post by Disastrous @ Wed Apr 06, 2016 11:27 am

Il Duce wrote:
Disastrous wrote:
Deuteronomy wrote:
Disastrous wrote:Strawms - yes I could, but I'm starting to feel like that man from Spaced who was so off his tits he was hearing techno out the toaster.

Deuts - Interesting you say that. Pissing about with the valves can sort of balance it and make it stop *sometimes* but not always. Didn't know that about always being slightly open though so will start again with that in mind tonight.

Stuart - That's ridiculous! I'm not paying anything at all for some magnet-based cleaning system. Might as well use Voodoo.


No, you need one fully open, usually the bathroom towel radiator as they're pretty shit for heating the room.

Essentially the hammering can be caused by the TRVs being forced open then snapping shut as the pressure drops as the flow rate increases.

I



Noted. Now you mention the bathroom towel radiator, I suspect it is always fully open but will double check.


Remove that broken TRV on the one radiator. See if that stops it.
You should be able to just unscrew the furled bit, below the white plastic bit, by hand and it and take it off.
Don't worry, no water will come out.

Image


Hmm, when I say broken, I mean it's actually snapped off.

See on your picture, how there is a threaded collar that attaches the turny bit to the piping? Well under that there is a vertical pin and the turny bit pushes that in or out as you turn it (presumably out means closed and in means open?)...

So it's already off and I have fcuked about with it a lot but it isn't helping.

Presumably I can order a replacement turny bit so I can eliminate it from my enquiries? What are they called?
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